Brakes

Wednesday, 17-Jan-01 07:34:43

152.163.213.184 writes:

Just wondering what kind of brake set ups you folks are running? What master cylinder? discs or drums etc.

thanks

demian in INdy

Demian in Indy

Replies:

Re: Brakes (Steve Arndt) (17-Jan-01 10:16:57)

Re: Brakes (Alex) (17-Jan-01 10:56:58)

I'm not running anything near as exotic as Steve and Alex. On my 65 I've got a set of CB dropped spindle disk conversions up front and I'm running drums in the rear. I am running a 67+ dual

circuit master cylinder and resevoir for the disk/drum combo.eom (n/t) (mikeb) (17-Jan-01 12:01:07)

Alex, are you happy with that mechanical brake booster ? Is it really effective ? (n/t) (Jean-Louis) (17-Jan-01 12:35:12)

I have not tested it yet. It is installed but the car is not finishid yet. The only thing it does is when you step on the brake it pushes the brake cylinder more so you have more brake

pressure with less pedal movement. I have a pic that I could send you if you send my your email address (n/t) (Alex) (17-Jan-01 16:59:25)

Doh.....it is the brake cylinder piston you push....I guess (n/t) (Alex) (17-Jan-01 17:02:52)

Discs on all fours, 67 master cylinder (n/t) (Jim Brown) (17-Jan-01 12:35:31)

I have a bit bit less exotic plans, too. Stock Ghia/Bug front discs snd I want to try front drum wheel cylinders on the back to balance things out better. Stock '68 master cylinder. (n/t) (Ed)

(17-Jan-01 12:56:51)

Re: Good cheap brakes ...>>> all VW parts. ( Mark H) (17-Jan-01 14:21:36)

4 wheel discs on my piece of crap. What else would one use to slow down from 130mph on the highway, don't wanna miss my exit!! (n/t) (Darryl) (17-Jan-01 15:05:47)

Type III front on Jatech dropped spindles, 914 rear, VW dual-circuit master cylinder (no check valves), DOT-5 silicone brake fluid, braided teflon brake hoses on my '60 Bug. Also make

sure you have tires that will keep up with the improved braking abilities! (n/t) (Craig Merrow) (17-Jan-01 17:38:13)

I second that. That's pretty much my setup, including the DOT 5 fluid, highly recommended. (n/t) (Bruce Tweddle) (17-Jan-01 20:46:26)

australian made wide 5 discs on the front, standard drums on the back, with a twin circut mastercylinder. i used to have discs on the back aswell but they kept draging (residual pressure for

rear drum mastercyl?) (any sugestion on how to fix this) (n/t) (henry roberts) (17-Jan-01 19:08:39)

wiwood has a residual pressure valve to keep this from happening, i thought mine were dragging, also, but they were actually getting too loose, and not tracking the rotors properly (n/t)

(bugly) (17-Jan-01 21:55:10)

Then your rotors have too much run-out, fix the real problem, ylgub. (n/t) (h mot) (18-Jan-01 14:13:21)

stock '63 bus master cyl. running four wheel disc brakes (front Opel Kadett, rear Wilwood Dynalite singles) with a "cutting brake" to select either front or rear "at will") running ATE super

blue fluid, oh, yeah, this is in my 15 second bus (n/t) (bugly) (17-Jan-01 21:52:28)

I GOT A HOLE IN MY FLOOR, AND I USE MY FEET! (n/t) (FRED FLINTSTONE) (17-Jan-01 21:56:56)

Here is my plan. It isn't all installed or tested at this point.

85 ATE 944 master cylinder

Hurst line lock

Steel braided DOT lines

996 Porsche front brakes.

944 rears w/ 951 calipers

That is about it. It should stop from 130 to zero fifteen times with zero fade.

Steve Arndt

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944 Turbo front disk brakes

Kerscher rear disk brakes

Specail Master cylinder from CustomSpeed&Parts

Mechanical brake booster from Tafel

Braided steel lines

I have a set of Kerscher front vented disk brakes for sale. They have the 5x130 Porsche bolt pattern and come with German bearings. Never used

just installed once. Disk spindles are also available. Price is 375$ + 50$ for shipping via UPS. Got them from Ahnendorp and are 500$ new

without shipping.

Alex

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Since high tech has been covered ,I guess I`ll cover the low tech side :-)

For years I have redone peoples VW braking systems with mix and match VW parts. It costs nearly the same as stock brakes but stop much much

better! If you have a 64 and earlyer Bug then you are better off with a 65-66 master because it is (smaller) in diameter and gives more leverage

on the wheel cylenders. Make sure the gook at the store is selling you the right one though because lots of stores sell the pre 64 masters for 56-66

cars and visa versa. The pre 64 are 19mm and the 65-66 are 17mm.

If you have a cal look type car with bigger tires in the rear then you also need to bias some braking power to the rear. This can be done by 1st

going with new 67 and earier rear drums (if you are running wide 5 lug) and having them turned to except the wider 68 and later shoes. You must

check the drum to see if it can be turned. The Italian ar german drums usually have plenty of space to turn the to wider shoes.

You may have to change backing plates too .

Next you can go with a (front) wheel cylinder in the rear. Front cyls are larger in diameter than rears so putting them on the rear gives more

pressure in the rear. You can use your old fronts to see if they fit on the rear to find the right cyl that fits. Basicly if it bolts up and its the right

width ,then it will work. I`ve used 68 and later Bug front wheel cyls on some applications and they worked great.

Then the last thing ,which could be the first thing you do is to go to a better brake shoe.

The replacement shoes that they sell today suck!

They aren`t even as good as the original stock shoes. You can have simi -metalic meterial bonded to your shoes by any good reshoing place. Its

the same stuff the comes on every new cars disc brake pads. If you can`t find a place to do your soes then Kimco (in Hot VWs) has them. They

are cheap compared to other types of better shoe material. There is also wover shoe material that is the same stuff used on big rig trucks. Thes

shoe materials make a BIG difference in how you drum brakes work so this is one step most VW owners should take considering the poor quality

of stock shoe material these days.

Well if you rebuild your stock brakes this way you will be suprised at the difference. Especially when stopping from high speeds.

Then you can save up for high tech stuff like discs :-) an have good brakes in the mean time.

PS even though no one does it any more it is very important to arc your shoes to your drum diameter. (fit the shoe curve to the drum curve)

If you have a disc sander on a stand with a straight 90 degree rest,you can arc your own shoes but do it very carefully and slow. make sure to

keep the shoe straight and do it from both sides. Good luck all,

Mark H

I'm trying to find a 1967 only brake fluid reservoir (US spec). It must be the one which fits in the wheel well next to the washer bottle but with

the two outlets for dual circuit brake systems. These were only fitted to US cars and so they're a little thin on the ground here in England.

I have decided to run discs all round on my 70's drag race car inspired 1967 vw 1500 beetle and figured why not make the change to dual circuit

at the same time.

I am in Leicestershire, England but am willing to pay a fair price for the correct item and postage.

I can be reached on [email protected]

Thanks

Bobby

Click here to reply

Replies:

with running rear discs. i found that my rear (disc) brakes dragged constantly, due (i think) to the fact that the master cyl. was designed for rear drums (which need a constant pressure in the

line to counteract the springs between the shoes... or something like that). there is supposed to be a way to modify the mastercyl. if you strike this problem, but i never got the details. (n/t)

(henry roberts) (17-Jan-01 20:19:24)

if i recall properly, the '67 master cylinder has a residual pressure valve which retains about 10 pounds of pressure in the rear circuit at all times. this keeps the springs (shoe springs) from

overcoming the line pressure and makes the shoes stay out near the drum. so far, so good. now we have disc brakes, the 10 lb residual is too much. you need to change to an earlier style with

no residual pressure valve, and add a 2 lb. valve, instead. this will keep just enough pressure in the system to keep the pads from backing off, but won't keep them up against the rotor too

hard. you might get away with not using the 2 lb. unit, but in my case, the pads backed off toomuch, and made a lot of squealing noises (also made them wear out faster). good luck! (n/t)

(bugly) (17-Jan-01 22:50:40)

I run no residual pressure valves, works bitch'n on my 4 wheel discs (Tom H.) (18-Jan-01 00:27:19)

where in the mastercyl is the risidual pressure valve? i would love to have my rear discs back. (n/t) (henry roberts) (18-Jan-01 18:56:31)

Bobby, if I read your post correctly you are looking for the resevoir only, correct? Do you need the cap, metal stubs out of the bottom? I run one in my 65 and it fits in there great. Let me know all that you need and I'll keep an eye out. eom (n/t) (mikeb) (18-Jan-01 11:31:02)

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don't neeed no stink'n pressure valves.